Episode 119 Summary

Penny Armour was born a “gestational diabetes baby” and had increased body mass from a very early age - Despite eating the same foods as her siblings she gained significantly more weight than they did and became overweight. She was sadly conditioned from an early age that thinner was better and encouraged to join Weight Watchers at the age of 9, with the approval of her family doctor, starting off what would become a lifetime of yo-yo dieting. 

Penny has been to see dieticians and has been on every diet imaginable - From the soup diet to Jenny Craig to Gloria Marshall, to Weight Watchers, to the CSIRO diet. The more extreme diets sometimes made Penny very unwell, and when she sought medical care for these concerns the priority was never her health or wellbeing but the focus was entirely on the amount of weight she was able to lose. She lost confidence in the care of medical professionals who she felt only cared about the number on the scale rather than her as a person.

In her forties Penny found that her weight had increased to 165kg -
She had type 2 diabetes, osteoarthritis affecting her mobility and felt like she was in the body of a 90 year old. Following a suggestion from her daughter, Penny began to research and learn about ketogenic nutrition. She was eager to find Australian sources.

Penny continued to struggle with perfectionism - She felt like she had to be perfect 100% of the time or it would guarantee failure, but life isn’t perfect. No-one is perfect. Following a ketogenic program she and her family were able to lose a significant amount of weight, but during covid isolation with guests in her home who were comfort eating processed foods Penny found herself again having a bit of everything. She eventually regained the lost weight. Her health declined and she was hospitalised then put on increasing amounts of insulin to manage her type 2 diabetes.

The beginning of 2022 was a stressful time for Penny - Her mother’s health was declining and she had constant demands on her time from everyone around her and her own needs were swept aside. Her mother unfortunately passed away and in her grief Penny made a snap decision to sign up for the wait list for the 12 Week Mind Body Rebalance, not really believing that it would help and worried it might be a bit “airy-fairy”, but as she had paid for it she was committed to giving it a go. A bit like Lynn Forsyth from podcast episode 56. https://www.rlmedicine.com/56

The 12WMBR was different from previous “diet programs” - Penny felt supported as she started to work on psychological changes, such as becoming aware of and addressing her highly critical self-talk. She realised that the way she was speaking to herself was unkind and she would never have ever spoken to another person in that way. This was a light-bulb moment for Penny.

During the second week of the program she was hospitalised -
Penny was extremely ill with pneumonia. She hadn’t yet fully commited to the program but was slowly implementing changes. Penny was shocked by the food that was served to her as the hospital’s diabetic diet, which was processed foods and extremely high in carbohydrates so reached out in disbelief to share it with the group. She was astounded by the caring response she received with people reaching out to her and asking if they could help to supply her with some more helpful food. This was an incredible turning point in Penny’s journey as she finally realised that she wasn’t alone in this. She suddenly realised that she was worthy of the kindness that was being shown to her, after a lifetime feeling judged, shamed and unworthy of acceptance and internalising that shame and judgement. She was worthy of kindness. She fully committed to the program at this point.

Penny has found herself more able to accept her imperfection and this leads her to make choices which are helpful for her -
These choices may not be "perfect" but  decisions like comfort eating cherry tomatoes or chicken instead of processed food can be incredibly helpful and she celebrates these decisions because they are so helpful for her. She has found herself able to accept and embrace that she is human, and things happen, mistakes will happen, she won’t always be perfect and that’s ok! She acknowledges what has happened, picks herself up and keeps going. This has been an incredible mindset transformation for her. Others have seen the transformation in Penny both in her health and mindset and are supporting her in her choices. Her relationships are changing as she has realised that she is worthy of love.

Shame and judgement do not work for gaining health or losing weight permanently - They are not helpful or effective.  If you are in a situation where you've got somebody who you love, who perhaps you're worried about, don't use shame, to motivate them, because you will send them further and further away from where they need to be. Love and kindness are required to get well, to heal, to learn to trust ourselves again.

Weight loss is not a meal plan. It's more than a meal plan - It is a personal journey of self discovery, self acceptance, knowing that you are good enough as you are and that you're doing this for you. Not for anyone else's approval. Not so anyone else will love you. You're doing it because you deserve it.

Penny has made some changes in her life for her own betterment and wellbeing - She is making herself a priority now. She is studying a science degree at university and moving house to an area where she is happiest. She is going to make the changes that she needs so that she can be a happier human and live a longer, healthier life.

Join the wait list today for our wonderful, transformative 12 Week Mind Body Rebalance. We would love to support you on this incredibly worthwhile journey.

Click here for the 12WMBR

Show notes:

Episode 119 - This little light of mine


Dr Mary Barson: (0:11) Hello, my lovely listeners. I'm Dr. Mary Barson.


Dr Lucy Burns: (0:15) And I'm Dr. Lucy Burns. Welcome to this episode of Real Health and Weight Loss. Gorgeous ones it’s Doctor Lucy here. Just a reminder that our seven day no sugar challenge is starting very soon. The challenge goes from January the 30th. But of course, we have a two day prep. So you can get started on January the 28th. Seven days for $7.

Just go to our website: www.rlmedicine.com/nosugar

And today I am super excited to introduce the most spectacular guest, Penny Armour has completely transformed. Not yet her health, but her mindset. And I am thrilled to introduce you to her, because some of the pearls that she shares with us are just mind blowing. Gorgeous Penny, I would love you to be sharing some of your story with our fabulous listeners. Because I can tell you now you are a) a superstar, b) not perfect and c) I have a wonderful story to share. So lovely woman, if you could perhaps give us a few details, we would love to hear you.


Penny Armour: (1:42) Okay, so I am 48. I was born, what they considered back then a diabetes or gestational diabetes baby. I have had a continued weight problem since then, even as a young child and for as long as I can remember, it's always been an issue for everybody else, always. And I'm the eldest of three. So I have a younger brother and a younger sister. And I used to always say to people, “What I don't understand is, we all live in the same house, we eat the same meals, we have the same food options, you know, how is it that I have this problem, but they don't?” Not that I wasn't loved. I felt really like something was wrong with me, inherently wrong with me. So I was in Catholic Primary school and got to grade three and my Holy Communion was coming up. And my mom and dad were very much like, “Don't you want to be thin like all the other girls in a pretty white dress?”

Dr Lucy Burns: (2:56) Oh, God.

Dr Lucy Burns: (2:56) And my dad had been on and off Weight Watchers for many years and had had quite a lot of success. He'd lost quite a bit of weight. And I decided, well, I think I decided I don't know, because in hindsight now there was probably a lot of directing going on, but I decided to become a Weight Watchers member. So our family doctor signed a letter saying he thought it would be best and they allowed me to join up. So over the course of grade three, while preparing for communion, I lost all of my weight and became a lifetime member aged 9.


Dr Lucy Burns: (3:35) Nine! Oh my God


Dr Lucy Burns: (3:38) What does a nine year old know about lifelong dieting and eating and, you know, maintenance and any of these things? Absolutely nothing. Nothing. You know, as long as you got on the scale each week, and things were dropping, and you were changing. And..


Dr Lucy Burns: (3:56) So already you can imagine then at nine you were being conditioned, that you were more acceptable if you were thin.


Penny Armour: (4:05) And it was better for my health and it was better for you know, all these things. And I was a ballerina. I loved ballet, I loved it. I had terrible coordination. Most clumsy kid. Couldn't ride a bike. And somebody suggested to Mum and Dad that dancing would help with my coordination. And it did. It did. Absolutely. But I was always the little fairy elephant in a tutu. 


Dr Lucy Burns: (4:37) Yeah


Penny Armour: (4:38) Was one of the terms given to me. Do you know what I mean? It was an affectionate term and you don't know to think of it any other way as a kid. Do you know what I mean? And got to the end of the concert. I think it was my first year of dancing. And of course you've got all the sequins and the costumes and everything. And I was I think six if I'm right, I was six, five or six. And they had this costume, but they were like, “It's not going to fit her. So, either we have to work out a different costume for her, compared to all the other girls, or exclude her from the routine.” And my mum instantly pulled me out of that dancing school and moved me to another one.


Dr Lucy Burns: (5:29) Oh, good. I was thinking you're about to say she pulled you out of the routine?


Penny Armour: (5:32) No, no, she did pull me out of the routine, because she wasn't happy. But she moved me to a different school. However, I did lose the weight at age nine, I was still dancing. It's funny because I say introvert and everybody goes, “Oh, my gosh, you talk so much, and you whatever”. And it always reminds me of a movie based on a Maeve Binchy book where she says, “I might look like I have the hide of a rhino, but comments still get me like anybody else, they still hurt”. And that pretty much has been the summation, you know, there isn't a single thing any person on the face of this planet could say to me that I haven't said 10 times worse to myself, unfortunately. And one of the concepts that really struck me when I started with the 12 Week Mind Body Rebalance was Dr. Mary, obviously, was holding Max and she said, “If you wouldn't say to this beautiful baby, what you're saying, then you shouldn't be saying it herself.” And she got us to write down one of the tasks, just write down some of the things you know, before she said that. And then when she said that, I'm looking at my list, and I'm in tears. Because of my… I would ever say that to another soul. Like not a single person on this Earth, doesn't matter who they are. And then I suddenly realised just how much hurt was there.


(7:17) And so it's funny because as I say, you look back and you see all these pivotal or key moments, you know, where the road went one way or the other. Even before you were making decisions for yourself, really. It's just so ingrained now that trying to challenge it is really difficult. And I never could have done that on my own. And I had never been in a position where I had been able to find somebody who would help me do that. You know, I'd been to see dieticians. Liked most people, or like most women anyway, been on every diet imaginable. You know, everything from the soup diet to Jenny Craig, to Gloria Marshall, to Weight Watchers, to the CSIRO this and to the you know, don't eat this and that, you know, and everything. Everything. Been there, done that.
(8:26) Another one of those moments for me was when I was on the soup diet. I'd been doing it for seven days. And by the sixth day, I had started passing out. And then vomiting started and I passed out in the shower on the seventh day and went to work and had a really icky moment where I thought I was going to be sick, turned for the bathroom and ended up being sick all over the perspex window of my boss's office.

Dr Lucy Burns: (9:03) Oh my goodness!!

Penny Armour: (9:05) And I'm just standing there, horrified, horrified. And I get to the doctors that night. And I'm like, “I can't do this. Like, this is how sick I am.” And he said, “Yes, but the good news is you've lost seven kilos in one week. Isn't that amazing?” Yeah.


Dr Lucy Burns: (9:21) Oh my God.


Penny Armour: (9:22) Are we talking the same thing here? Like do you understand what I'm saying to you? You know, and I just, the older I got, I became more and more adverse to doctors. I got to a point about three years ago, where I had topped out at 165 kilos. I had type two diabetes. I had severe osteoarthritis in my feet, ankles, and my knees were in really poor condition. I was only 45 at the time, and I had the body of someone in their 90s, or worse. My daughter came home and said, “I want to try this.” Since she was 16 at the time, and I've always walked the fine line because Mikayla was a gestational diabetes baby herself. I am a fourth generation type two diabetic. The odds are stacked pretty high for Mikayla.

Dr Lucy Burns: (10:34) Yeah, you've got some genes that are not in your favour.


Penny Armour: (10:38) No. Exactly. And she had just been diagnosed with polycystic ovarian syndrome, which I also have. My Mum had also had huge gynaecological issues and resulted in a full hysterectomy at 41. So it's definitely a long family history. So I said to her, “Okay, we'll give this a try.” I slowly but surely did a lot of research and found Thermo Foodie and the Chef. I found Aaron Day, I found Megan Ellem. And so I was very keen to find people based here in Australia, and started putting information together and started following ketogenic protocols. But I have always lived as a perfectionist, I'm very, very bad with my perfectionism. So everything must be perfect, or I'm failing. And life is not perfect. I have learnt the hard way, there is no such thing. So what I was basically doing was continually setting myself up for a guaranteed failure. And of course, as many many people know, this stuff in your head, of course, then goes, “Well, we've been here before. And you should have seen this coming. And of course, you weren't going to succeed. And, of course, this is and of course that”. And I was determined it wasn't happening this time. So over the course of almost two years, between the three of us we lost 122 kilos. Michael, because he's a man, and they suck sometimes. Excuse My French. He lost the most, with doing the least.


Dr Lucy Burns: (12:35) Yes, the least pain.


Penny Armour: (12:39) And so he had lost just over 50 kilos, I had lost 42 kilos. And Mikayla had lost 20-something kilos. So, everybody wanted to know what our secret was and what the magic potion was and the quick fix and the whatever else and it's like no such thing, unfortunately. And the minute you tell somebody they're not allowed to, well that you're choosing not to eat bread anyway. It's not about not being allowed, but choosing not to eat bread, pasta and rice. The horrified looks are unbelievable. I was accused a couple of times of child abuse. No, I'm not joking. So I was apparently child abuse with my 16 year old daughter who instigated the whole thing. May I just say!


Dr Lucy Burns: (13:28) For giving her you know, whole foods that she's that she likes and has chosen.

Penny Armour: (13:34) Yeah, correct, because you know, cauliflower, broccoli and chicken breast are so terrible, you know. And then COVID hit. And we had my parents come and stay with us. They are divorced and have been divorced for 20 something years at that point. We were confined to this house. Mum returned to stay with my brother on the farm. So she was only there a short time, but Dad stayed on. And it became a situation where like many people during COVID, Dad was turning to food for comfort. At first one snuck in so I was like, I've just had a half of something from Baker's delight with Dad. And he's you know, and it's all good and it doesn't matter. I'm in control. And after six months of lockdown, it was fair to say control had gone right out the window. I now wasn't tracking it anymore. We were living back on bread and pasta and rice and all these things and the weight was stacking on for me in particular and I had lost control again completely. 


(14:47) Then at the start of last year. There was a lot of stress. My sleep hygiene has always been a bit off. I have bipolar. So as part of my bipolar I find sleep very difficult. And my quality of sleep is not great. And it's not uncommon unfortunately for me to go two to three days without sleeping at all. So particularly during a manic episode. I ended up in a DKA. So which is a diabetic ketoacidosis. And spent the day in hospital. They took the fluids away, the minute I arrived at the hospital, told me that it wasn't a DKA, that I just wasn't looking after myself, and left me laying in emergency for the day. And I left the hospital with a script for insulin, and was told that was it, I was on insulin now. I lost my mum. So we moved house a week later. So we were in the midst of a huge move around the bay. So it was very fun. And those are the things I manage. My husband is an amazing provider and amazing man. But the day to day life stuff is me. So I'm trying to manage all of that. And still not really paying attention to what had just happened to me, trying to gloss over it.


Dr Lucy Burns: (16:14) Yeah, put it in the too hard basket.


Penny Armour: (16:17) Yep, I had to relinquish the job, because there was just no way to do it. So I'd only been there three weeks. So that was another failure. So I'm chalking all these great failures up for myself. And then Mum needed me, family needed me, everybody needed me. So we'll just ignore me and we won't, you know, and the whole time I'm working with the diabetes education unit, and the insulin is growing and growing and growing. So we lost Mum, at the end of July, unfortunately, and I had a moment of, I just lost my mind pretty much and because grief, of course is a very funny thing. And I stopped taking all my medication, including my insulin. So I boycotted everything. So no bipolar medication, cold turkey, which for anybody who doesn't know, you don't stop those medications, cold turkey, they pretty much do very nasty things. Stop the insulin, cold turkey, stopped everything, and stopped eating. So I did a seven day fast where all I had was water, and pretty much checked out of life and refused to do anything. And after seven days, agreed to a small meal of steamed vegetables.


Dr Lucy Burns: (17:40) So can I just go back a step? What was the thought process behind this? Why were you doing it?


Penny Armour: (17:45) So I was very mad. Because my Mum had done all the right things and everything, asked her and she'd taken all the medications and she’d done all of the things and it hadn't kept her alive. No. And I was very mad at the world. I was very mad at pharmaceutical companies who were just preying on people like me. And I got a bit caught up, to be perfectly honest, in the mindset of somebody out there who's got a cure to cancer, but because it makes the pharmaceutical industry so much money, they don't want to bring it out. You know, all those sorts of really dark, really mad really not based in reality stuff. But that people drop in, you know, and because I was grieving and I wasn't in a headspace to be rational. And all these things that are filtering into you, particularly from social media, people were putting things out going, “Isn't it wrong how this happened?” Isn’t it wrong!” And you know, and you're going, Oh, okay, and so I was very much like, well, I'm going to stop all that. So screw them, they can't have my money, they can't have my life, they can't have my body. And I'm just not going to eat until I'm ready to eat well, and I'll fix this myself. But I was a very angry human. Very angry, and a very combative human at that point. So I registered for the waitlist, gave it some thought, then thought I wasn't going to do it. And then in a moment of absolute, we're not going to think about this. I chose the three month plan. And I went,”That's it. Done. I've committed now they've got my credit card, too bad.” I've paid the first one. I'm doing it. So I started.


Dr Lucy Burns: (19:37) Yep. Do you know, do you know what this reminds me of? We had an interview with a lady called Lynn Forsythe last year, and I'll link the episode in the show notes  https://www.rlmedicine.com/56 and she started it to sort of prove to everyone that it wouldn't work. Because she was so sure that nothing would happen. And then she could say to them, “See, I did it and it didn't work.” But uh if you listened to that episode, you will see that there were some life changing moments for her as well.


Penny Armour: (20:05) Absolutely. And I have heard it and yes, very much so. So, well, this was me. So I was like, “Okay, and this could be a bit airy-fairy, and you know, it's probably going to fail. But you know what, look, I've committed the money now. So I have to do it.” You know, like, even if, then I think I was two weeks into the 12 weeks, and I developed pneumonia, and wound up in hospital. So I had pneumonia, and a pretty severe infection. And I was in a really bad way. And I wound up in the hospital. And I was rushed by ambulance, my sister was talking to me and I had called her. My blood sugar had dropped to 3.1 or something like that. And I was shaking quite badly. And all that stuff that had happened before had started to happen, but for the opposite reason. Because by that stage, I wasn't eating at all again, because I was so ill, I didn't want to and you know, all these things. And the diabetic diet comes, that is so well known in a public hospital. So, “Oh, we believe you're a diabetic?”  “Yes, I am.”  “Okay, we're going to stop insulin, because you've had a hypo and you're not really eating.” So you know, yep, that makes sense. Fair enough. All good. 


(21:28) But the diabetic diet comes, and it is two WeetBix, skim milk, two pieces of cold dry toast, margarine, a tub of fruit in sugar syrup. And that was it. And I just had this moment, and I had been making little changes, slowly as the 12 weeks had started. But I really hadn't committed to it, I was using insulin as a crutch. And it was like, wow. And by that stage, I was on 52 units of insulin a day as a type two diabetic. And that's a lot. And they were saying that within two days, because my levels were still quite high, I would be going up again. So 52 units and increasing. Anyway, I looked at this diabetic diet, and I was like, “You've got to be joking.” And I remember taking a photo of it, and posting it in the group. And people like, “You're joking.” And suddenly, a big thing happened for me. It was big for me. Because all these people I really, I didn't know, do you know what I mean? Like these were strangers to me, effectively. start posting. And they're like, What hospital? Are you in? What part of Melbourne? Are you in? You know, can we come and drop you something? You know, can we? Like these complete strangers? And I was like, why would someone do that? For me? I don't understand why a complete stranger would want to do that for me or want to help. And it really turned for me at that point. Because I suddenly realised that A) I wasn't the only one in this situation. B) Although I felt up to that point, like this had been a really lonely road, even though I was surrounded by people all the time. I've always felt very isolated, very alone, in a room full of people. 

Dr Lucy Burns: (23:37) Do you know what though? That's because all the other times you felt judged, shamed, different. And you had also internalised that so the voice in your head was always judging yourself, shaming yourself to sort of, for motivation. And suddenly, people are showing you kindness. .


Penny Armour: (24:03) Yep. And I'm just going to say it as it is, which is, I have lived a life of feeling completely unworthy of kindness, of love, of acceptance of anything good really.


Dr Lucy Burns: (24:20)

Yeah. Do you know what that stems from though? That stems from back right back when you were a little girl, when you were six. And you were the fairy elephant, when you were on Weight Watchers to do the communion because unless you lost weight and were thin, then you weren't acceptable.


Penny Armour: (24:37) Yeah. And that's exactly right. And one of the things that I say people, particularly medical professionals, would say to me all the time, “Don't you ever wonder how you got this way?” I’m like “No, I know exactly how I got this way. I can tell you because I literally spent my life in a battle of wits with my mother”. It was like, well, if I'm not enough, like I am, then screw you, I'm not doing anything so that you will accept me. And so, ultimately, and I own this 100%, this was me, not her. But ultimately, in order to get her approval, and to get what I felt was her love, I stood my ground and went, “You're gonna learn to like me the way I am. Or this is never changing. Because, while it bothers you so much. And while you feel like, this is the one thing you can't control, because I have all the power in this one situation. I have all the control in this one situation.” And I can't tell you when that thinking started, but I can tell you I wasn't even 10 years old when that thinking started.


Dr Lucy Burns: (26:00) So do you know one of the most amazing things in all of this Pen that I think, is that as you said, for 40 years, you have been judged and shamed. And you've internalised that, so you've judged and shamed yourself. And that, that hasn't worked. Like that. That doesn't work. So for anybody out there who thinks that they're going to motivate somebody by judging them or shaming them, or suggesting… 


Penny Armour: (26:31) My Mum would call it tough love, Lucy. Tough Love. Sometimes we just have to give tough love.


Dr Lucy Burns: (26:37) Yeah, well, I think that, no, it will not work. And if you are in a situation where you've got somebody who, who you love, who perhaps you're worried about, for God's sake, don't use shame, to motivate them, because you will send them further and further away from where they need to be. You know, it sounds trite, but love and kindness are what we need to get well, to heal, to trust ourselves. You've also, you recognise at the start, you're still vulnerable, you haven't forged new neural pathways. So you're making the situation as easy as possible for yourself. And now, over time, you have forged new pathways, and that pathway is really about deciding what you want, not what you can’t eat, but what you want to eat. And again, as the perfectionist who is giving herself grace, that she may be soothing, but with cherry tomatoes and chicken, it's like, “Great choice!” Like, “Go you!” And accepting that it doesn't have to be perfect, does not have to be perfect.


Penny Armour: (27:53) No, and in fact, in the imperfection is the satisfaction. You know, because I'm human, things happen. I'm still going to make mistakes, I'm still going to fall down. The real test of the change in me is that I get myself up, immediately dust myself off, acknowledge what's going on. And keep going. And I have never been that person. You know, never been that person. I have been the, “hit the stuff it button” for a month, not even a day. I screwed this month, you know, we're done, you know, probably even been guilty at times of going, “Stuff it this calendar year’s out!”, You know, like where, you know, Summer's past. So you know, let's not worry, because we're going into winter now. And it's all about comfort, and you know, this and that.


Dr Lucy Burns: (28:50) Yeah, and I can wear big clothes and get away with it.


Penny Armour: (28:53) Yeah, exactly right. And so, whereas this is absolutely not that, if I have a fall. It is that old adage of, if you fall off the bike, you get up and you get straight back on, you know, and that's a very new concept to me. So, and I love that. It's one of the things I've been able to implement so early on, for me, like it's still only four months. Like, you know, I sit here talking about this stuff. And, and as I say, I said at the very beginning, in some ways, it feels like last week, but in other ways. It feels like decades, you know, because it has been so profound, it has been so challenging. And I still have those moments where the tantrum in my brain happens, you know, with the little toddler that goes, why this isn't fair? I don't deserve this. Why is this happening to me? Well, hang on. Let's just really look at that. let's reframe this a different way, you know? And so those are hugely profound things, you know, I'm, after doing this wheel last week in, in in momentum, you know, I found that so difficult because virtually every part of my wheel was scored really low, you know, and except for which I was able to take something from actually because, community relationships and intimacy, you know, I was actually really good with myself about scoring that because I'm really proud of what I've achieved there. And with my husband and daughter and with my family members, because, you know, three years ago, there was a lot of, “Oh, no, this is silly. And this is a fad. And this is this, and this is that.” Now, you know, like today, I, I put a message out, we have a family group chat in Messenger. And I put a message up saying, “Podcast interview about to commence shitting bricks, in all honesty”, with this shock face. And my daughter was the first to respond within seconds saying you're gonna smash it, have fun. But then my sister, and I got, “They want your truth. No guesswork. They're just realness, and honesty, no need for shitting bricks, this is a chat about your reality. And you, my sister, love a chat. And you know your truth. All too well. You take a deep breath and a sip of water and get ready for a chat. If you inspire or give hope, or relieve just one person, then that is success. And all one can hope for. Love you, proud of you for just being you.


Dr Lucy Burns: (31:53) That's so beautiful. I’ve got all little goosebumps. 


Penny Armour: (31:56) Yeah, it was. It was just such a huge moment. Because it's not that I didn't know, they all love me and all that sort of stuff. But there's been a real acceptance of you, do you? You know, you do you! And this is what it's all about.


Dr Lucy Burns: (32:14) Do you know what else, Pen, what is in there is that on one level, you go, yeah, I know, they love me and all of that sort of stuff. But on that deeper level, you were still in that belief that you weren't worthy of their love, that you didn't deserve it, that you weren't good enough. And that's the bit that's changing, and has really changed.


Penny Armour: (32:36) And that's what they're seeing, which is what's really nice. It's not that she said those words, it's that it's not just talk, because I have spent a lot of time in my life being just talk and I know that, but they are seeing action, you know, and I remember being in Girl Guides, and they used to sing this song. They used to sing a song called This little light of mine, I'm gonna let it shine, you know. And I have finally, as an adult, realised exactly what that song is all about. And it's in the doing, and the making mistakes and the falling over and the being accountable and the acknowledging it and the ownership and all of those things. That is making them see the real beauty of anybody's journey. No matter what that journey is, you know, because it's never going to be perfect, and it's never going to run to plan and it's never going to be smooth, because that is just not life. It's just not life. And if I can achieve anything, I want what I call my kids, so my nieces, my nephews, my God, children, all that sort of stuff. I want them to see possibility. I want them to see the possibility that people are capable of change, and that it's okay to mess up. It's okay to realise you did something wrong, but own it, apologise if necessary, and move on and make it different. Because you can do that. And if all the people in my life hadn't given me second third 475th chances I don't know where I'd be right now. You know? And, and that's okay. You know, that's okay.


Dr Lucy Burns: (34:46) Absolutely, ah gorgeous woman I tell you what your little light is shining. It definitely is. So I think that your story today will inspire people out there, who will see that, you know? I mean, look, we bang on a lot that weight loss is not a meal plan. It's more than a meal plan. Because it is this personal journey, this journey of self discovery, self acceptance, knowing that you are good enough as you are. And that you're doing this, you're doing this for you, not for anyone else's approval. Not so anyone else will love you. You're doing it because you deserve it. Yeah.


Penny Armour: (35:28) Yeah, 100% Because I want more. I want more from my life. And I've got big plans. And I've got big plans. I'm starting a Bachelor of Science in two months. And I am going to complete the first year of this bachelor this year, no matter what. I'm going all the way. And I want to try and get back into part time work. And we're moving back to our happy place, which is down to the Mornington Peninsula, and we're making decisions that are for our happiness, for our betterment, instead of sitting around and worrying about what everyone else is going to think and how it's going to affect them and how they're going to feel and how… I'm not moving to the moon, you know!


Dr Lucy Burns: (36:15) Yeah,


Penny Armour: (36:16) I'm still gonna be here for everybody. But my sister has taught me one thing, she's amazing. And she's been studying as a mature age student and in her 40s with three kids, two on the spectrum, working as well to become a nurse because it was what she always wanted to do. And she battles MS. And she has all of these things on her plate. And I think she's an amazing human. And she said to me, Pen, your one challenge this year is to get good with saying no. Because sometimes, no is just as much about love as yes, you know, it's okay to say no. And it's okay to say, these are the things I want for me. And the only way to achieve them is to prioritise my needs. And in return, you're gonna get a better version of me anyway, as a byproduct. And as a byproduct of all of that. I also get to be a healthier human who lives a lot longer and a lot happier life


Dr Lucy Burns: (37:28) Ah, darling. I love that. I love that beautiful woman! Thank you so much for being on the podcast, the gems you have shared have been phenomenal. I am so happy to be watching your journey. Given you're moving to the Mornington Peninsula and I have set myself a challenge of 55 coffees, of coffee with 55 different people this year, I think that you'll be on my list.

Penny Armour: (37:52) That’d be great. I'd love that.

Dr Lucy Burns: (37:56) And thank you for everything that you do, that you share with the RLM community because you know you are..


Penny Armour: (38:07) It’s really selfish because I get so much more out than I give. It's so true.


Dr Lucy Burns: (38:13) Oh no, but you know what, it's the vulnerability that is inspiring for people, it is that bit they're going, Oh God, you know, I'm not perfect. Nobody wants to hear the perfect version, which is never true anyway, because that's just unhelpful. The helpful story is the whole story. And that's what I love. You are a real, you're a real person. I love it. Thank you. Good. All right, beautiful listeners have the most wonderful, wonderful week and we will catch up with you next time. Bye for now. Gorgeous ones if you'd like more information on the 12 week Mind Body rebalance. The next round starts February the 11th. If you go to our website, you'll see it on the front page there,www.rlmedicine.com  Just click on the link and it will take you to everything you need to know. Bye for now. So my lovely listeners that ends this episode of Real Health and Weight loss. I'm Dr. Lucy Burns.


Dr Mary Barson: (39:17) And I'm Dr. Mary Barson. We’re from Real Life Medicine. To contact us, please visit www.rlmedicine.com.


Dr Lucy Burns: (39:27) And until next time, thanks for listening. The information shared on the Real Health and Weight Loss podcast, including show notes and links provides general information only. It is not a substitute, nor is it intended to provide individualised medical advice, diagnosis or treatment, nor can it be construed as such. Please consult your doctor for any medical concerns.

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