Episode 91 Summary
- Weight Loss is more than a meal plan, it’s a personal development journey. Dr. Lucy and Donna Hann, creator of “She’s in Business”, discuss the many parallels between reclaiming your health and becoming a successful businessperson.
- Dr. Lucy and Donna Hann discuss Dr. Libby Weaver’s concept of “The Invisible Backpack”. They remind us to be mindful of and realistic about our available time. Don’t overload yourself with tasks and responsibilities. They myth bust the concept of multitasking being easy and delve deeply into task switching. Task switching instead of multitasking allows you to be 100% involved in what you are doing and removes the pressure that comes with trying to juggle multiple tasks at once.
- Using a Time Management System can reduce the feeling of being overloaded. Time-block the tasks you need to perform in the next week and tick them off as you go. This does not need to be complicated. This creates a rewarding sense of achievement and with each achievement that you acknowledge it can help to establish a new, positive self-identity.
- To avoid becoming overwhelmed or exhausted on any venture it is important to prioritize self-care. Self-care is not all about bubble baths and cups of tea. Sometimes self-care is about making those difficult but necessary decisions. You may need to say “No” or to weigh up the negative impacts vs the benefits when making a choice. Be aware of the negative impact of overscheduling extracurricular activities for children. Sometimes it may be wise to select one over another if exhaustion is impacting your child or family. We can set a positive example for our children in this way.
Donna Hann is a business coach to entrepreneurial Mums in business.
From the age of 19, Donna Hann has developed a long term fascination and love for
entrepreneurship. Her journey has lead to businesses in children's party entertainment, corporate professional development, online retail and a highly successful and award winning dance studio.
Taking the lessons learned and experience from starting and growing 3 successful businesses, (1 pre kids, 2 with kids in tow), Donna is the creator of ‘She’s in Business’ and the ‘Ready To Rise’ online course designed for Mum's who are made for more.
As a business coach and business educator, Donna helps ambitious entrepreneurial Mum’s transform from feeling overwhelmed, exhausted and frustrated into thriving entrepreneurs feeling savvy, fulfilled and energised women; ready to rise to the next level in business.
Connect with Donna:
Click here for Donna's free Ultimate Productivity Planner.
Episode 91: Beautiful Boundaries
Dr Mary Barson: Hello, my lovely listeners. I'm Dr. Mary Barson.
Dr Lucy Burns: And I'm Dr. Lucy Burns. Welcome to this episode of real health and weight loss.
Dr Lucy Burns: Good morning, lovely listeners. It's Dr. Lucy here. This week, I am without Dr. Mary, but I have a super, super, special guest this morning. So I'm really excited to introduce her to you. But, before I start, I wanted to read a review of our podcast and I would love it, it would be so helpful to us if you wouldn't mind writing a review or even just ranking it with the stars if you're on Apple or Spotify. But this is a little review, our most recent on the 3rd of May from somebody who's nea090382, who has written, “Thank you! Credible, informative, and helpful advice on how to lose weight eating low carb real food. I have learned so much and eagerly look forward to each week's podcast. I can't recommend it highly enough.” Thank you, Nea, it is so kind of you to write that! And we are so grateful that you spent the time to write us a little testimonial. So please lovelies, if you feel like it, we would be immensely appreciative. Now, let's get down to business. And speaking of business, I have a lovely guest today! Her name is Donna Hann. She has a business called “She's In Business”. And she's a wonderful, wonderful business coach and course creator with a fantastic programme called Ready to Rise. As you know, lovelies, we often talk about how Mary and I have really had to learn about business. And so we employ coaches, we've joined a programme, and I met Donna in this programme. So Donna, welcome to the podcast.
Donna Hann: Thank you for having me. I'm excited today to talk to you, Lucy.
Dr Lucy Burns: Ah, well, you're welcome. And I'm excited to hear the things - the pearls of wisdom - that you've got to share with our listeners.
And lovelies, I was on Donna's podcast a few weeks ago. And we drew some big parallels between, I guess losing weight or reclaiming your health, going on your health journey and going on your business journey. And as Donna is an expert in business coaching, I thought well, why don't we have her on our podcast and translate business and life, because they're really part of the same...
Donna Hann: They really are. And when we had our conversation on my podcast, it was, as you said, like drawing those parallels together. It was really interesting in trying to get that healthy blend in, you know, whatever it is that you choose to do, but certainly businesses a big part of what I do, and in working with a lot of women in the business space, it is getting that healthy blend of which self care is so important, which is so much of what you talk about.
Dr Lucy Burns: Absolutely. And I think you know, we've got a few, we've got lots of little lines that we love. And one of my favourites is that weight loss is more than a meal plan. It's a personal development journey. And I would say that running a business is very similar.
Donna Hann: Absolutely. Oh, my goodness, you learn so much about yourself when you become a business owner, that's for sure.
Dr Lucy Burns: Yes, absolutely. And as you know, I think like lots of things, business has its ups and downs. And you know, there's lots and lots of different quotes about, you know, a successful business person, you know, there's many ingredients, I guess, in that recipe for success.
So what I'd love for you is if you could share some of the ingredients that you think that would help people become successful in business, because I already know that they're going to be also the same ingredients that help people become successful in their weight loss journey.
Donna Hann: Yeah, I agree completely. Yeah. So I guess if I start with what I do within the programme that I offer, and the ladies that I work with, and then I think from there, it will lead quite easily into the different things that I use to help them with that.
So I help either women who are in the startup phase of their business, and they're wanting to avoid the path of burnout, they're wanting to avoid the mistakes and build a really successful business from the get go. And I also work with women who already have an established business, but they find themselves feeling overwhelmed and exhausted and on that path to burnout.
A lot of the women that I work with are also Mums. And so it's that juggle between business and raising a family. And usually when both of those things become quite busy, the first thing to fall off the list is self care. And so what I do is I, you know, teach a lot around building those foundational business skills to build confidence and also ability and you know, to make sure that we're running our businesses successfully. But I also talk about, you know, how you can shape your business. And I guess that kind of ties nicely into shaping your lifestyle in what you do in creating a healthy work life blend. So, for me, I'm talking about how you can be a savvy, entrepreneurial business woman, you can be in the moment and present with your family and the people who mean the most to you. And you can also take time out of both of those things for your own self care without feeling guilty or feeling like it's a selfish act, because I firmly believe that it is absolutely essential to look after ourselves. So that then not only can we show up for ourselves, but we can also show up for the people who mean the most to us, our children, our family, you know, our friends, but also within our workspace, whether that be in a business, or whether you work for somebody else, we need to show up in all of those areas of life. And we can't do that, if we are on that road to burnout. And you know, we're struggling in just, you know, putting one foot in front of the other and showing up and living our best life. So that's where my passion comes in is helping people to really live their best life by bringing those things together.
Dr Lucy Burns: It's interesting, isn't it? Because burnout, I know can happen to both men and women, but it seems to be much more prevalent in women. Why do you think that is?
Donna Hann: I think that as women, we carry this incredible invisible load with us everywhere we go. And I read a book by Dr. Libby Weaver. I quite like some of her work that she does. And she talks about the Invisible Backpack that we carry. And we're constantly putting more things into that backpack all the time. And over time, that bag becomes very, very heavy. But at the start, we don't necessarily notice it. It's kind of like this progressive thing. And before we know it, we're like, “Oh, my goodness, I don't want to do this anymore. I'm not feeling like I'm fulfilled in my life, I've got no energy, I'm feeling resentful of this, this, this, this and this”. And there's just no no balance, there is no blend there, of that healthy mindset and that healthy body and all of that kind of stuff. And I think that we need to cut ourselves some slack. First of all, we need to lower our own expectations of what we can manage. And I think we need to not worry about what other people think of us as well. I think that's a really big thing that probably drives us to do more and try to be more and not let things go or not put our hand up for help when we need it because we're worried about what other people think of us.
Dr Lucy Burns: Absolutely. And I think women are highly critical of themselves and worried that if they ask for help that is somehow a failure?
Donna Hann: Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, I agree with that, too. Yeah.
Dr Lucy Burns: So, you know, I have this concept, and I'm sure you talk about it a lot, around time and magical thinking that we can somehow invent time.
Donna Hann: Yes.
Dr Lucy Burns: And, and it's interesting, because you know, there's all these funny old memes that we'll talk about, you know, that a man can only do one thing at a time, and that women are the great multitaskers. But that I think has actually been a lot of our undoing. What do you think about that?
Donna Hann: Yeah, I do. I do think it's a lot of our own doing. And I also know that it's an absolute myth that we can multitask. And instead, it's more like task switching. So we're effective in switching from one task to another quite quickly. But it's such a huge use of our energy in doing that, that it becomes very exhaustive very quickly. And so I think we need to change our way of thinking around that, or at least better manage our time, and go, okay, if I'm doing this one thing, I'm doing this one thing, maybe you can group like, tasks together, like I like to do a lot of batching. And that works really well, because then it's not so much energy and task switching, you're just kind of doing like, light black things. But I think too, it's, for me, I think when you can really focus your energy on either, you know, being 100% in whatever it is that you're doing, whether it's 100%, in working on your business, or 100% in being with your family or 100% in being, you know, mindful on the walk that you're taking as part of your daily exercise or mindful in your eating whatever it is that you're doing, be 100% in that moment. And then I think it kind of removes the pressure to be out to be doing lots and lots of things at once and just know that you will get to those things if you plan and manage your time effectively.
Dr Lucy Burns: Yes, absolutely. I think that this is part of the you know, the access to technology, technology's wonderful, but also a double edged sword. And you know, you're sitting there, like, I kind of think right back in the old back in the olden days. Back in the days before computers where you were perhaps writing a lot of your things. There wasn't a mobile phone to disturb you. There was the old phone with the little coily thing. And if you didn't want to be disturbed, just took it off the hook. And that was the end of that. And nobody bothered you. But now between, you know, the phone, your computer dinging, even your watch, any of those sorts of things, it's so easy to be interrupted!
Donna Hann: Yeah. And I think the other thing that I have used myself for many years, and that I share as much as possible, wherever I can, is having a time management system. And that can sound very complicated, but it's not for me, I am a pen and paper girl. I like to write down my to-do list and I like to tick it off. There's so much satisfaction right, in putting that tick in the box! And so I have this planner that I use to manage my time, and I'm happy to share it with you. And you can share if anyone's listening. And I use it, obviously from a business perspective. But I also put all of my other things that I need to do for that day on each of those sheets. And so what I find is that I do that on a Friday afternoon, I brained up everything that I need to do for the next week and then I sit there and I work out what I need to do for each day. And I time block that. So that I'm not trying to do two things at once. And also so that over the weekend, I can actually switch off and completely unplug because I know already that my week is mapped out. Whatever it was that was sitting in my head that I knew I needed to get done is going to get done. And it just lowers that stress level. So I can unplug from my business. But it also means that I'm far more effective in using the time that I have just that, you know, as you said, we need more hours in the day. But in fact, we've got enough hours in the day if we manage our time effectively. And that's a really great way that I found helps to manage my time, dial down my overwhelm and hit my goals as well or, you know, achieve whatever it is that you need to achieve for that week.
Dr Lucy Burns: Yeah, absolutely. And you know, what I love about that is that you're so intentional with what you're planning to do. And I think for a lot of people, they just hope that they'll find magic at some time to do something. And you know, that might be, you know, doing some business task, or it might be going for a walk or going to the gym or buying food at the supermarket. And it's really interesting, because I often wonder if people are taught this or not. And I certainly wasn't taught it. I didn't realise that people had systems in their life until I was like, probably till I was a mum like, I spoke to one of my friends. And she says I will every second Wednesday, I wash the towels, and I go really, you have a system, I just wash them when they look a bit dirty.
Donna Hann: Yeah!
Dr Lucy Burns: It never occurred to me that you could systematise everything.
Donna Hann: Yeah, you totally could. And that's a really good point, when I first became a mum too, I was like, wow, there's so much to do around here, you know, the amount of washing that a baby makes and you know, you're just on call, aren't you all the time you just start something and then you've got to stop it because, you know, you've got to attend to something with the new baby. And that was one of the pieces of advice that I was given is like do something every day around like, you know, Mondays is bathrooms, Tuesdays is this or whatever. And it really helps to get everything done, but also in a way that doesn't feel like you're overloaded with stuff to do. And if you can achieve that. I think that's the other thing too, is sometimes we don't get that sense of achievement, because we overload ourselves with the amount of things that we want to do. But there's so much as I mentioned before satisfaction and ticking that thing off, but it really helps to feel like you're achieving and that you know you're doing good for whatever it is that you're doing. It makes a massive difference to your mindset.
Dr Lucy Burns: Ah, totally, totally. And I think it was James Clear, who talks about the idea of, you know, identifying the person you want to be and then doing little things to enforce that identity. And if you're doing the little things but you're not acknowledging them, then your brain forgets you've even done them and therefore you're not moving towards that new identity that you want to be.
Donna Hann: Yeah, I love that!!
Dr Lucy Burns: Lots of people will come and say to me and probably to you too, I really just don't have time to do that. And for us, it'll be you know, buying real food or preparing their food, you know, and they're wanting a different solution for that problem. What are your thoughts on things?
Donna Hann: I guess there could be a couple of things on that. Like, I think boundaries are really important. And I know that you also feel that boundaries are super important as well. In being prepared to set those strong boundaries around what you will say yes to and what you will say no to, and you know, that relates to so many different areas of life. You know, I would imagine and this is for you to speak to I'm sure but in having boundaries around what choices you make when you're at the supermarket. What are you prepared to say yes to or no to of things that go into your shopping trolley. And usually, for me, what I talk about with the ladies that I work with is that boundaries need to first come from your value set. So you need to get really clear on what your core values are. And then shape things around that. So then it actually makes it really easy to hold your boundaries, because you know where they're anchored to. And so I guess a good example of this is, if I relate it to business, is that if you perhaps are constantly tested by your clientele, to work longer hours to be able to accommodate them, or, you know, a really amazing opportunity has come past your your desk or your inbox, and you're like, I really, really want to do that. But the thing is, in saying yes to that, what are you also saying no to? So, for example, if a client needed you to work late because of their roster, perhaps, would that then mean that you would have to say no to perhaps tucking your child into bed that night, or reading them a story book, or having a, you know, a chat with your partner after work and debriefing, and you know, all of that kind of stuff, building that connection within your family unit. Which is more important, because one of those is going to suffer? You're either going to say yes to the client, and then no to your family. Or if you say no, to your family, you're saying yes, to the client. Did I just say that, right? Get the idea, right?
Dr Lucy Burns: Absolutely.
Donna Hann: Yeah. So it's working out those parameters, and then putting boundaries around that. And I think the other thing that really works well is having someone to keep you accountable to those boundaries, too. I'm a little bit - in the past- I've been a bit of a workaholic. I strive to do the absolute best that I can in the time that I have. And sometimes I stretch that a little bit. So one of my boundaries is that I work between school hours. So you know, between sort of 830, and three o'clock when the kids go off on the bus, and then come home on the bus, those are my work hours. When I'm not held accountable sometimes, and I've got a lot of work to do, I will push those boundaries, but my husband's pretty great at reminding me. And it would just be a little tap on the window. If he's like out in the yard doing stuff or he'll poke his head in and go, “Do you realise what time it is?”. And at the same time, as I'm like, are, you know, I want to tell him like, “This is my time, I'll do what I want to do!” In the same instance, I know that it comes from a place of good intention. And he's actually holding me accountable to the boundaries that I've set for myself. And so I think that the other great thing is to have someone who keeps you accountable. And I'm sure within your programme, you might offer some accountability around helping people with their health. And I think that's wonderful to have.
Dr Lucy Burns: Absolutely. And I think, you know, boundaries are one of the hardest things to maintain. And I think, you know, like you said, you've got to be added to define them first. And then the maintenance is tricky, because at the end of the day, the reason that sometimes our boundaries get eroded is because we're good people, and we want to be kind and help somebody else.
Donna Hann: 100%.
Dr Lucy Burns: And again, that that can be sometimes one of your values is that you're your helper. But when that helping comes at a sacrifice to yourself or your family, then it's no longer helpful to be a helper.
Donna Hann: Yes, yeah.
Dr Lucy Burns: And I think it's interesting, we will sometimes say yes to something. When deep down, we want to say no, for various reasons. We say yes. And then that yes, comes with a whole swag of resentment, because we didn't really want to say yes, but we felt guilty saying no. So we swapped the guilt for resentment. And the resentment just eats away at people and makes you tired and bitter.
Donna Hann: Yes, yes. And I think we've probably all got a situation that we can apply to that and relate to that. 100%. Yeah, I think that's where sometimes, you know, if it's not a hell yes, then it's an absolute NO.
Dr Lucy Burns: Yep. Yes, absolutely. I love that. Oh, yes. Yes, “I gotta go to the supermarket and do my shopping. Hell yeah.”
Donna Hann: Or the other way, which I guess kind of like links into another thing. In regards to the topic that we're talking about today, being self care, is saying this has worked so well, for me is going I need to look after my future self. So in this situation, what is the best thing for my future self? Is it a hell yes? Or is it a No? Or can I rate this out of 10? If it's really tricky, and you're like, Oh, I really want to do it. Can you rate it out of 10? Consider the future benefits of that opportunity, versus the negative impact of doing that. And if you write those like a pros and cons list, I guess, and you rate those things out and you go okay, what is the best choice for my future self that I will thank myself for later? I think it's a really great way of moving away from finding yourself in a state of resentment and making the right decision the first time rather than learning the hard way.
Dr Lucy Burns: Absolutely. And what are your thoughts these days? I mean, we know that kids these days have lots of extracurricular activities.
Donna Han: Yes, they do.
Dr Lucy Burns: Mine certainly did. And I remember thinking that I couldn't stop any of them, because I would feel guilty, or maybe I would be depriving them of a future opportunity. But sometimes, there literally, well there wasn't enough time in the day, but I still made it happen. But there was a cost to that. What are your thoughts on that?
Donna Hann: Well, it's interesting that you bring that up, because this year, we have actually increased the number of extracurricular activities. And the reason being is that earlier this year, I sold a business and that business is a dance studio. And so I was always, well not always, but I felt as though I needed to have a bit of freedom around the afternoons of time, because in case I got caught in, and so this year, now that I don't have that business anymore, I'm like, “Right, kids, what do you want to do?” And so you know, our extracurricular activities have grown. And I am at that point where you're like, Okay, we can't possibly take any more on and, you know, we need to make some choices. And we did make a choice around that for one of my children in one of his activities that he wanted to do, and it was getting too late of a night for his age, and all of that kind of stuff. And I guess, again, it's looking at the benefits of it versus the negative impact of it. And, you know, that could be of a negative impact to, you know, the child itself. Like for my son, it was a late activity, he wasn't getting home, he's only nine. He wasn't getting home. It finished at 830. By the time I got him home, and then, you know, he wound down and he was hungry again, because he had early dinner and now like, you know, we were ready for dinner number two. And so, he didn't cope with that, because he's a really early riser, like he is up before the sun. And so, you know, we had to just make that call. And yes, he was disappointed. And you know, his friends at school are still doing it. And so, you know, occasionally he's like, why can't I do that anymore? But it's just like I said, looking at that negative impact and going, it's just not worth it right now. And, yeah, taking that guilt away, I think in just knowing you can't do everything, and that's alright, you know.
Dr Lucy Burns: And in fact, I think that is just a beautiful example of self care and care for him. So it's caring for you, but also as the adult, you're making a decision on his behalf, that is actually about his self care. And so when people you know, just describe self care as thinking it's cups of tea and bubble baths, which is absolutely part of it. But it really is making those decisions that are not always easy.
Donna Hann: Yeah. And I think it's an opportunity to teach your children about those choices, too. So, in making that decision, it wasn't just like that we went “Oh well, you're just not doing it anymore.” It was a conversation that we had around, “Okay, well, if you do this, then what does that mean? And how do you feel at school the next day, and, you know, then you're tired for, you know, football on a Friday night? And which of those activities do you enjoy more?” So it's just, you're using it as a teachable moment for them to also start to learn about self care as well, which I think, you know, we're raising young adults, we're not raising children. Actually always frame it around that we're raising adults, we've got to teach them those things. And so yeah, for us, it was a teachable moment.
Dr Lucy Burns: Ah, absolutely. I love that. And again, lovely people, with lifestyle, everything we do is a teachable moment for our children. They are watching. So this idea that you know, as parents that you have different you know, some people have completely different food to their kids. And I find all of that so interesting, like they've got food that they wouldn't eat because it's not healthy, but they'll give it to their kids or the dog. And you know, that kids are watching, they watch everything and you know, I think we need to always be mindful of that and talking to them about your choices and the reasoning behind it is so helpful for them and for their future selves.
Donna Hann: Yeah, and that can be really hard sometimes, if you know, you've had a busy day yourself and sometimes, you know, you're scratching through the bottom of the freezer to find something to feed them and stuff like that. And that can be really hard when you're running a busy lifestyle. But again, I think it's that thing of preparing yourself well in advance, okay, you know, like, I do like to meal plan for the week. And my meal planning is very, very basic in that like, you know, it's just a notepad that I think I got from Kmart or something that was like a $2 notepad, that's a meal planner. And I just write in the boxes like what I'm cooking. I don't go into the detail of, you know, what's in it and all that kind of stuff, but it just gives me a bit of a map for the week ahead to go okay, this is what we're doing. I don't then have to think about it. I just go right so we're having, I don't know, spaghetti bolognaise for tea tonight? Excellent. Let's do it. And the other thing I like to do is double batch where I can, for things that freeze well. So I know that I've got those options in the freezer rather than reaching for, you know, chicken nuggets and frozen chips for tea. I know that I've got, you know, something else that's in the freezer that I can just defrost and add veggies to or add pasta to or something like that. But yeah, it's tricky. It's really tricky. Sometimes managing a family, it's a lot.
Dr Lucy Burns: Ah, totally! Well, things come up. But again, I love that idea that you know, you talk about batching food as well as like batching business tasks. Yeah, I batch cook, I always cook. Because if I'm going to cook, if I'm going to bother getting out the stove, well I don't have to get out the stove but you know, chop up the chicken, chop up whatever, all the veggies, it doesn't take much longer to do double than it does to do singles. So you're definitely saving time. And then your idea of having the meal plan is a bit like your Friday afternoon sit down for your planning for your week.
Donna Hann: Yeah, it is. Yeah, I hadn't thought about it that way. But yeah.
Dr Lucy Burns: And it just takes that cognitive load off your Invisible Backpack when you're tired.
Donna Hann: Yeah, I think another way of looking at it too, is you know, when you have your computer screen open, and you've got all of those tabs open, if we can close some of those tabs down by doing a meal plan by planning out your week, you know, that can really help you to feel less overwhelmed. And also to fire, you know, for your brain to work more effectively. Because you're not kind of like filtering through all these different tabs to find the one that you want. There's less tabs to kind of work your way through. Yeah.
Dr Lucy Burns: I totally love that. That also, when I have my computer when I have like 50 tabs open, it doesn't run as effectively. It's sluggish.
Donna Hann: Yeah, I know. I sometimes do have too many tabs open on my computer, I look up and I go, “Oh my god, this is ridiculous!” And then I just take a minute to close them all down. But it easily builds up, doesn't it! Just like it does in life like, you know, those computer tabs that you just open this window and open that one and you need this one open. So you can drag this to here. And that's how it happens in life too. Except it's you know, different activities and responsibilities and stuff.
Dr Lucy Burns: Absolutely. Absolutely. Donna, it has been a delight to talk to you.
Donna Hann: Thank you.
Dr Lucy Burns: If people would like to follow you or make contact with you. How do they find you?
Donna Hann: Well, my website is donnahann.com. You can also find me on Instagram. So it's @donna_hann_sib, which stands for she's in business. And I will definitely make sure I get the template of the planner to you because we've sort of circled around that a fair bit in this conversation. So I'll just definitely make sure that that's there for people if they want to go and grab it. But yeah, those are probably the best... or I guess the other one is to tune into the podcast which you are a guest on for me too. So that one is “She's in Business”. And yeah, there's heaps of episodes there around different facets of being in business and managing a family and mindset and all of that kind of stuff.
Dr Lucy Burns: Wonderful. Wonderful. Thank you so much for your time today, Donna. I really appreciate it. Lovely listeners. I will be back next week with another episode. So I'll catch you then! Have a wonderful, wonderful week. Bye for now.
Dr Lucy Burns: So my lovely listeners that ends this episode of real health and weight loss. I'm Dr. Lucy Burns.
Dr Mary Barson: And I'm Dr. Mary Barson. We’re from real life medicine. To contact us, please visit https://www.rlmedicine.com/ . And until next time, thanks for listening.
Dr Lucy Burns: The information shared on the real health and weight loss podcast, including show notes and links provides general information only. It is not a substitute, nor is it intended to provide individualised medical advice, diagnosis or treatment, nor can it be construed as such. Please consult your doctor for any medical concerns.